Special Guest: STEVE MCCLUSKIE - Author of 'Around the World in 80 Games: The Earth Shaped Ball'

Over 6 years, across 97,000 miles, 6 continents and 35 countries, I became the first person to go Around the World in 80 games. Armed with a ball and four jumpers for goalposts, I had kick-about’s from the cloud forests of Costa Rica to the chaos of Kampala; the splendour of Vienna to the distant shores of Osaka. I would place my jumpers down in random places and invite passers-by to join in the unadulterated magic of a game of footy. What began as a reaction to the gluttony of modern football at the top level, turned into a journey beyond my wildest dreams. The incredible people I met along the way tell this story. All brought together by the earth shaped ball.

Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Around-World-80-Games-Shaped/dp/1805414836

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Daz O'Connor, Steve Wilson, Nik O'Connor, Glenn Kewley, Julian Lane

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:10

Hi everyone and welcome to another episode of the Liverpool Can Action podcast. This is the StoryPod episode. I just want to say thanks everyone for tuning in, especially in 2023. It was just an amazing year for the podcast, not just for me, but for my wife, for Steve, for Julian, for Glenn and for Del Cross, so I really appreciate it. As always, like and subscribe my next guest.

Speaker 1: 0:44

I was really intrigued by his book. I found him on a facebook group and no, I'm not a stalker, but you know, when something comes out at me, I jump on it and and it's a really cool story. Uh, I'm about halfway through the book. Obviously, he's an author. He's got this amazing book that we'll talk about as well. It's called Around the World in 80 Games, the Earth-Shaped Ball. It's right here and please, please, go out and get it. You can get it on Amazon and all good bookstores, but the author is Steve McCluskey. This is his first podcast, so he's a podcast virgin.

Speaker 1: 1:30

We get to, as they say, pop that cherry. But I'll go easy on you. I'll go easy on you. Thanks guys. Welcome to the podcast, mate. Thank you. I know we're going back and forth, as life is, you know, for the past month or so, but you're fine. Finally on, I'm glad to have you on. You know, cannot wait to talk about the book because I kind of feel the same way you feel about football was going. I I feel exactly the same way. But let's get into. You're a Liverpool supporter. I am, yes, with all my heart and you're a Lancashire lad, aren't you?

Speaker 2: 2:17

I'm a Lancashire lad, which is it's about an hour away from my home, to Anfield. My dad was born in Ayrshire, as was it's about an hour away from my home to Anfield. My dad was born in Ayrshire, as was Bill Shankly, and so I was brought up a red as a result, and I just remember seeing red. It was my first colour. I had to support Liverpool and Scotland, whether I liked it or not. When I was a kid I mean, luckily, when I was growing up, the Reds were on fire 70s, 80s, and so there was a lot to love. But yeah, as far back as I remember, I was a Liverpool fan. I was a Liverpool player in the schoolyard kicking the ball about, you know, obsessed, and my first game was actually away at man City Main Road. I think I was about 11. I was 11. I think Kenny got a hat trick that day and yeah, I was lucky enough.

Speaker 2: 3:17

About 25 years ago, a friend of mine went living in Canada and he said you want my season ticket. I said do I want your season ticket? I said where is it? He said it's on the cop. It's on the cop behind the goals. I said you're joking. So, uh, I've been going all that time and luckily the guy next to me couldn't go to every game. So I've been taking my son since he's, since he was eight years old. So it's something we've done together. So it's more than football for us. It's kind of like it's probably the closest way we get to religion, us two, you know, and it's something that it's bonded us together, father and son. He's obsessed. He's probably more obsessed than I am now. The indoctrination is complete, as you know.

Speaker 1: 3:58

I mean, have you seen that? It's like a little film, not stick figures, but it shows like a uh dad with his son, and then they walk and then the dad dies. Oh my god, that that's what it reminds me of, like you just saying that, uh, you know, like for me, my, my dad, was not interested in football it was but it was my granddad that first took me, you know, and, um, yeah, that that little little film just like just reminds me of that.

Speaker 1: 4:39

And then, you know, like I said, with, with your son, and and I've got girls as well, I want them to go. You know, I'm 3,000 miles away, so it's a bit different. But, you know, whenever I'm back home and I do finally take the kids, and I'm sorry, whoever's going to be on my airplane, I'm sorry, I have four girls and everyone, absolutely. So please forgive me, you know, know, I'm just saying that ahead, but yeah, it's just something that you, you want your kid to be involved in, don't you? Yeah?

Speaker 2: 5:14

I remember he came home from school whilst he was seven, maybe seven he said, uh, all my friends, support man united. I want to support man united, and luckily we were having a rainstorm at the time. So I took him to the back door and said look, that's where you are sleeping tonight, out in the backyard. Dad, I'll never say that, ever again. I'm like right, okay, I mean, some might class that as child abuse, I don't know, but it had to be done, you know. But no, he's. Yeah, we just love the club, we love everything. We just love Liverpool. Yeah, we do, we just yeah.

Speaker 1: 5:47

And was your dad your dad Tuckie.

Speaker 2: 5:50

My dad Tuckie was originally yeah, yeah, like I say, he was Ayrshire, he was a Kilmarnock man and but a big Shankly fan. Shankly was born just up the road at Glenbuck, um, which is in this book as well. It's. I had a kind of pilgrimage to Glenbuck when I did the Scottish leg of the the journey, and uh, it's a very emotional day. It's uh, it's all in there. So I kind of I didn't have a choice, and thank god I didn't have a choice. You know, it's uh, it's been one of the the best things of my life really following the reds. I used to go away as well, you know, especially in europe, and uh, not so much now, but uh, that's, that's my son's turn. Now he can, he can do all that. What? How old's the son he's?

Speaker 1: 6:40

28, yeah, 28, how old are you? I'm 55 just turned. Oh wow, yeah, man, that's like 28, jesus christ I know mate, tell me about it yeah, I'm in my 50s and I I've got, like you know, two eight-year-olds, a seven and a six-year-old. So I've got all that to come, you know, and I eight-year-olds, a seven-year-old and a six-year-old, so I've got all that to come, you know, and I'm just like pulling the air out but like, no, that must be great to you know. Go home and away with your kid.

Speaker 2: 7:15

Yeah, it's fantastic. It is. I mean, the other day when we got the news, I don't know if you were going to speak about Plot later, but he had to stop work. Yeah, he works with my brother, and they both stopped work and went to the pub. They couldn't carry on working. It's like a bereavement. So, no, they were just down in tools, that's it you know, I think everyone was.

Speaker 1: 7:38

You know it's one of those where you need to call hr and say you're having a having a day off because, uh, somebody's sick in the house or something. Yeah, it certainly felt like that. So who's you know? Because for me, kevin Keegan was my hero growing up. I only got to see him like for a year, but just what I saw, you know, I just loved like just the way he played. So who was your? Who was your hero growing?

Speaker 2: 8:09

up, it was definitely Dow Gleesh at that time. I think that was the Scottish connection as well, because my dad used to take me to the, to the home internationals, so I used to go and watch Scotland, england and you can imagine back in the day it was absolutely ferocious. So I'd be there with Lancashire Acton, with Scotland top on, you know, and watching Kenny play for Scotland and so, and then obviously it came down to Liverpool and so I was a massive, massive Dalglish fan. But that era really, you know, just going into the soonest years, hanson Lawrence and all you know, just going into the soonest years, hanson Lawrenson, you know that kind of team was just, yeah, beyond belief, just fantastic.

Speaker 1: 8:53

There were so many to pick from as well. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 8:56

Yeah, so many great players weren't there and I liked the team you know. A little bit later on with McMahon, you know, when Barnes was just ripping it up as well. So many down the years.

Speaker 2: 9:08

But yeah, we've been through it haven't we the first American owners and all the rest of it? So I'm glad that my son's been through all that. He's not just seen the glory years. When he was coming through as a Liverpool fan, we weren't exactly tearing it up, and then Klopp came along. So he's been through the law and he's experienced the high. So he's a proper fan now. He's cried the tears.

Speaker 1: 9:33

Well, I think, like a lot of people, just you know this is what I mean about like Klopp leaving. You know we've had like eight and a half going on, nine years with this amazing human being, not just a manager but a human being and it's been nothing, apart from really last season. It's been good times. So all these kind of new Liverpool supporters don't don't know the 80, you know the early 80s, don't know the 90s and certainly don't know the 2000s. You know what we've lived through, what we've cried through. You know we, we were dire, I mean. So you know, for for me, like you know, you, you go on twitter and uh, and people just really don't understand what we've been through as supporters. Absolutely, yeah, they'll have a go about FSG and they don't back him and all this. I'm like man, you don't know half If that's your only issue. You don't know half if that's your only issue. You don't know half the things that like what. You know what went on. What you know, it's just if you've ever seen Torben Pignic play football?

Speaker 2: 10:58

that's where you need to win yeah.

Speaker 1: 11:01

Or even Hans Jager yeah, yeah, we've seen. We've seen the good, the bad. Yeah. Or even Hatch yeah, yeah, we've seen. We've seen the good, the bad, the ugly. You know everything and you know still, still, still watch them every week. You know Thick and Thin.

Speaker 2: 11:16

Yeah, that's it. You'll never walk alone. It's not just a song, is it? You know, we stick with the boys through Thick and Thin, and you know, and stick with the boys through thick and thin, and you know, and it makes the good times even better, doesn't it? When you've experienced that?

Speaker 1: 11:30

usually makes beer taste a lot better yeah, yeah, absolutely yeah, it's still.

Speaker 2: 11:41

It can still ruin my week. You know, if we get beat, it's pathetic. I'm 55. You know, if we get beat, I mean it's pathetic, I'm 55, you know, but I should know better. But it can. It can certainly destroy a weekend, probably up to Wednesday or something like that, if we get beat on a Saturday.

Speaker 1: 11:55

It's not as bad as it used to be with me because I think, you know, just having the four kids like click me out of it quicker because I've got to take care of them, and but on a on a, on a day where I'm kind of by myself, it takes me quite a long time because I keep going over the game. I keep going, you know, because there's some games where we played really well and we've been beat and you just keep going around in your head like we should have done this, should have done that, because everyone's an armchair manager, aren't they?

Speaker 2: 12:33

Oh yeah, we're all experts.

Speaker 1: 12:34

Yeah, you know, get him off the pitch and then immediately the person that you want off the pitch scores or does an incredible pass or a boss tackle. We're pretty bad critics, but at the end of the day, we all want the best for Liverpool and a lot of people will probably say the Barca 4-0 is one of their favourite matches. You know, but yourself.

Speaker 2: 13:11

I mean, I was lucky enough to go to Istanbul for the final and I was at the Olympiacos game when Stevie scored the screamer. I mean the semi-final of the Champions League when we beat Chelsea with the goal score. The atmosphere that night, 45 minutes before kick-off, was just like something I've never experienced. But the very best day for me watching Liverpool was taking this on to the FA Cup final in Cardiff. The Gerrard final when he scored the screamer against West Ham.

Speaker 2: 13:44

Because when we were growing up it's the only time we had access to the players to see them on the bus on the way into Wembley on the FA Cup final day and everything stopped, you know, and all the kids came round our house and we'd all watch the Cup final, whoever was in the final and it wasn't the European Cup, it was the FA Cup. That was important growing up. So to stand there with Milad and then they started playing a vibe with me while I was like, honestly, I cried my eyes out. You know it's the FA Cup final. I'm here with Milad and it's Liverpool. It's like wow, and that just beat Istanbul hands down for me, even though that was just beyond belief for what it was. But the FA Cup was special, you know, and that's my favourite game that I've ever seen. Yeah, I think.

Speaker 1: 14:33

I think the FA Cup has lost its shine. You know I'm the same as you. When it was FA Cup final day it was, you know, your mum or your gran would get all the food ready. You know my mum couldn't stand football but she just loved the whole idea of the family coming. You know I was able to drink a shandy, oh, you know, 10, 12 years old.

Speaker 1: 15:02

You know, back home you're allowed a shandy. You know, a couple of times a year when we're in the final, but it was the whole day and, um, especially over here, it's a bit different. Like you know, they barely show pre-match stuff. It's maybe 20 minutes, you know, while back home it was two, three hours. You know, while back home it was two, three hours. You know, yeah, and I miss those days and I think because of, like, the champions league now and the league that's, that's your first two big ones, and it never used to be like that, did it? It used to be the league, fa cup and um, you know, I think it has lost its shine because I think back in the day also, you would have sometimes Liverpool playing against a League 1 side or a League 2 side. It's massive and everyone was out for it. Now it's just like if the big guns aren't in it, who really wants to watch it? You know?

Speaker 2: 16:06

Yeah, yeah, it's a shame really. I mean I remember looking out of the window when I was a kid on the FA Cup final day and the streets were deserted. Everybody was in watching the game, you know, and it's just another game now, it's just another weekend, you know, it's a damn shame really. I mean it was great the weekend watching, know, it's uh, it's a damn shame really. Um, I mean it was great the weekend watching maelstrom go through against ipswich. You know I thought here we go, there's a bit of magic back there. And when, uh, newport came back to 2-0 against united, you know, I was uh hoping against up there, you know. But, um, it has changed everything's changed the football landscape's changed, hasn't it?

Speaker 1: 16:42

well, that's a good little, uh little, segue into talking about the book. You know, like I said, your mindset is kind of just like mine. I was disillusioned with the way football's going, the greed, you know. So if you could, just, you know, tell us, you know where, where the book idea came from, and you know, obviously, it came with. You know your, your issues with football.

Speaker 2: 17:15

Yeah, well, it all came about because I was quite ill at the time. I had a really bad asthma attack and ended up in hospital and it was touch and go. And I guess a lot of people have epiphanies at times like that you know if they've got a condition or whatever might happen in life, and I'm laid there in hospital thinking, oh, you know if they've got a condition or whatever might happen in life, and I'm laid there in hospital thinking, oh, you know what's it all about? You know, and the two things I always wanted to do when I was a kid were write a book and see the world. And then so, as I was there for about four or five days in hospital and I'm trying to, you know, just think of a plan and a way to do both really, and then I thought I'm thinking about football and I'd started to turn off football.

Speaker 2: 18:03

I wasn't watching as many games. Anfield was had lost its spark a little bit during the Paul Lynch years and all that. It was getting a little bit more commercialised. And you know, I mean you had Setblatter and FIFA. They were kind of. You know, I mean you had Setblatter and FIFA. They were kind of.

Speaker 2: 18:17

You know the corruption there and I thought I'm falling out of love with the game that I love, you know. And why did I love football in the first place? And I was jumpers for goalposts, all the lads off the estate and the lasses having a kickabout on the local pitch. So I thought, well, it's our game, it belongs to us, it doesn't belong to FIFA, it doesn't belong to a confederation, it belongs to us and anyone can play at any time. And that was the origins of the game as well in the streets, you know, and in the fields where local people just picked up a ball, I mean, they used to wrestle for it back in the day. But, you know, it was always our game.

Speaker 2: 18:57

And I thought, well, it's been taken off us, it's been repackaged and sold back to us, like we should be grateful. And I thought, no, you know, no, let's, let's go and have a kick about around the world. Take four jumpers for goal posts and a ball and towers around the world, put the jumpers down and just see what happens. And that was it really. I had no other plan than that, das. And then the rest is history, as they say. So it killed two birds with one stone to see the world and to write the book, but also it involved my love of football, which was great really. It tied them all together.

Speaker 1: 19:38

So, yeah, yeah, I think for me, the disillusionment, just exactly what you were saying set platter, just, and even Michelle Platini, who I looked up to as a footballer, oh wow, yeah, you know, an amazing footballer. Uh, you know just greed, it's, it's just money, money, money. And then you just notice, you know, 70s and 80s, fa cup, european cup, final, nothing but supporters now capacity get. They get given 15,000 tickets each and then 30,000, 40,000 for you know the big wigs companies and all that, cocktail sandwiches and champagne. You know it's wrong, they don't care about football, they'll have their little Instagram. You know, I'm at the game. Who's playing, I don't know, but I'm at the game, you know, taken away from real fans. And I also think COVID showed me football without fans is crap.

Speaker 2: 20:54

Oh yeah, it's nothing, is it Sorry?

Speaker 1: 20:56

Even when they did that like you know, they had the little screens with, you know, fans it just wasn't real and it showed me like, without fans, football is just it's nothing, is it?

Speaker 2: 21:13

and that was kind of the last straw for me, really does, because, like when the suits were, you know formulating, is it? And that was kind of the last straw for me, really Daz, because, like when the suits were, you know, formulated in kick-off times, they weren't thinking about fans in England going to the games, you know, they were thinking about fans in Singapore or Thailand, you know, I remember what I was going to go to. It was we got Exeter in the Cup and it was rearranged to a Friday night and I think by the time I worked it out and I couldn't get a train back, it'd be like £250, £300 round trip to stay on. I'm like, wow, why should I have to pay that to watch my club when I live here? You know it's. It's just not right, you know. So anyway, so it was my small attempt really at kind of I don't know, bringing it back to the game, really, you know, and taking these people out of the equation for a little while.

Speaker 1: 22:07

Yeah, it's tough to watch. You know, something that we all love and all grew up on just kind of get torn apart and, like you know don't even get me started on VAR as well it's just it's. It's. Has it made football better? Like maybe VAR, the actual technology, but then the referees, or the clowns that are actually in Stockley Park, obviously don't know what they're doing. You know, and and that to me is kind of ruining football. You know, you think you've scored a goal and then you've got to wait two, three minutes to celebrate and then it's a muted celebration.

Speaker 2: 22:52

Yeah, it's kind of like hoovering the life out of footy. It really is. I mean, yeah, when a decision goes your way, it's a nice feeling, but when you score you say, when you score a goal, that's what you're going for to see your team score a goal but you can't fully celebrate and it's that horrible kind of you know. You initially celebrate but it's a horrible 30 seconds to a minute after.

Speaker 1: 23:21

You're thinking, oh okay, we haven't kicked off again yet yeah, so yeah, well, you're hoping it's a minute. It's usually you know, you could have gone, gone get a, a nice pie, you could have got a pint come back and they still, you know, um and an iron about something that everyone can see. Yeah and it builds.

Speaker 1: 23:38

That I think that's where I'm falling out of love with football is because of the decisions like that, you know, and and the greed and stuff it's, it's, it's wrong. But so for you, you know where, because it's got to be a lot of planning, you know. Right Travel around the world, I mean where you know. First, I'm sure you've got a giant map Right and I'm sure you didn't just do this or throw a dart at the board and go. All right, I'm going there. You'll be surprised. Uh-oh, not a good story.

Speaker 2: 24:21

I guess I always work. So I mean, the book took six years to complete and it was just a short of 100,000 miles in total. And when I set off I really didn't think about 80 games, I just thought, just do the first one. And you know, I never, never looked at the total, not till much, much later and I asked for a sabbatical from work and they gave me eight weeks. So I took that eight weeks and then headed down to New Zealand and Australia and through, through Southeast Asia, you know, because it was the furthest away, and I thought, well, let's do that first and get that out of the way, and that if there was any sort of plan at all, it was to do the country's furthest away and make my way back to England. So that's kind of how I looked at it, you know. Yeah, so I did sort of eight countries, I think, in the eight weeks initially and I came home and worked.

Speaker 2: 25:23

So I always worked and went, worked and went. You know, did a bit of crowdfunding at one point for a trip to Africa when I got made redundant and just, yeah, just made my way around that way, you know, uh, I sold my guitar, sold my amps, and you know that kind of stuff. You know, and there's a lot there. Really it's a it's a long story, but, um, yeah, it wasn't. I mean, there were some countries I was really intrigued about, like columbia, you know um, because of the Escobar years and everything about that country, and you know, um, everyone was saying don't go there. Whatever you do, don't go to Columbia.

Speaker 1: 26:03

You know it's uh, you might people say to you know, it's just like a child, Don't do that.

Speaker 2: 26:23

What are you going to do? You're going to go, do it. You're going to do it, aren't you? Yeah? So, uh, and just a beautiful place, lovely people, you know it's. Yeah, if you want trouble, you, you can find it easily there, but you can't in any, any town here as well, you know or any major city. So, um, yeah, I was like so I did it in spurts, really douch.

Speaker 2: 26:33

You know, I just did it in a book. A book said three weeks off and try and get as many countries in in a certain continent as I could. But the beauty of the book is I only had a rucksack and four jumpers and a ball, so I could literally just move wherever, whenever and put the jumpers down wherever as well. So I had games, you know, in the street, on rooftops. I had a game on a rooftop in India. It was the only place, because it was so packed out in Jaipur there was nowhere else to play. And this guy says I've got a roof. I'm like, okay, and it's flat, do you want to play? We'll have to move the laundry, but you know, and then we got some locals out and we played a game up there.

Speaker 2: 27:19

Um, and that was the beauty of it really. You know, we played on a bandstand in Zurich and on a bridge in Slovakia and wherever really, and there was no plan to the games. Usually it was kind of like just find a suitable space and then just invite people to play and see what happens. And do you know, the only place it was difficult was Georgia. It was Georgia, yeah, it was Georgia. Yeah, because it was on a Sunday, in the buckle of the Bible belt and people were looking at me very strangely and it took a while, but we got there. We got there in the end, you know.

Speaker 2: 27:56

So, did you take the? Is it just one ball or have you had many, many balls? Originally it was just one ball and I was going to take that everywhere and get it signed and all that kind of stuff. Then, when I got to Africa and India and realised they've got bugger, all you know, I thought, well, no, you need to take quite a few here and then give them away at the end. You know, I mean that Tanzania game you just mentioned before.

Speaker 2: 28:18

I walked in there with a football and it was like the Holy Grail and kids were coming up touching it like it was, like it was gold. They'd never had a, they'd never had a proper football in their village. And on the front of the book can I do a shameless plug of the front cover? So this guy here is called Giffy John and that was the. That was the ball they were playing with and that was banana leaves and string and rubbish and that was the village ball amongst about 50-60 kids. And so when they saw an actual football, it was like the Pied Piper. They were all following me out of the village, you know, to touch the ball. It was crazy you know.

Speaker 1: 29:00

Can you imagine, though I mean, you know, a lot of them don't wear shoes either no, no, actually kicking that other thing around? I can't imagine. That's the thing I think. Sometimes we're so far removed from what happens in other countries, we can't, like you know, grasp. You know they've never been able to play with a real football before. You know, you're just like what Everybody has footballs.

Speaker 2: 29:32

Yeah, it's very humbling. I remember being in Cuba and it's very similar there as well. They don't have very much and I just have the ball in my hand. I was in Havana, I think I think so and this guy comes running out of his shop. He said you can have anything in my shop if I can have your football for my son. And it was the only ball I had at that point. I hadn't played any games yet and I couldn't buy one anywhere. I didn't sell them and I said I'm really sorry. He said I'll take you and he showed me. He said I'll take you through the back of the shop to all the expensive stuff, whatever you want. I just you know, and I'm like, wow, you know. And yeah, it's an eye-opener.

Speaker 2: 30:19

But you know the people I met along the way, gaz. You know the. The people who had nothing gave me everything. You know, they gave me time, they gave me a cup of tea. They gave me, they gave me they'd give me the shirt off the back. Such lovely people always invited me back to their homes, meet the family, and they had nothing but what they had, they shared, and I came back to them like a child. All my wants and needs were just pointless.

Speaker 1: 30:53

One of the main things I get from this book is football makes people smile. Oh, sorry, I missed that bit. Football makes people smile. Yeah, absolutely yeah, the number one thing. Every chapter. You know the, the characters and there's so many characters in this book Like people are probably like, nah, there's no, he made that up, but it's just smile after smile after smile and the book actually makes me smile.

Speaker 1: 31:30

Oh, brilliant, brilliant. It takes me back to when I was young. You know, I used to play in the back garden by myself. You know, kick the ball, kick the crap out of me, me, dad's garage, like put dents in it, but I was happy. And then and again, you know it takes me back to, you know, going to the local park and pulling the jumpers down and and, just, you know, you go with your mates, like three or four, and then by the end you have like 20 kids, yeah, on a pitch and I mean it looks insane and it was insane, but it it's.

Speaker 1: 32:07

That's what I get from this book is just all different. You know, black, white, red, green, doesn't matter. You know, tall, tall, short, fat, thin who cares? You know, woman, just kick a ball around. You know whether you're good or not. And also what I found, steve, is some of these kids can really play. You know, I'm reading there's some incredible players, yeah, and you're just like you know if reading, there's some incredible players, yeah, and you're just like you know, if they don't have a proper footy, how are they playing like this?

Speaker 2: 32:44

Just, I mean, you know, in some of the villages in Africa there's very little else to do. They just spend all day kicking whatever they can around, whatever they've made, you know, and they'll just spend all day doing it. I mean, I met a guy in Israel at Bar Hall, and he could have played top-level football here. He was just absolutely dynamite, but he'd never get the chance. You know, he'd never get the chance to come over and to play and to go on a trial and that kind of stuff. You know, it would just be almost impossible. But what a player and he dedicated his whole life to it. You know, he had one pair of boots that were falling to bits. I mean, that's the thing is, you know, I got him a pair of boots and he thought it was Christmas and birthday rolled into one, you know, and it's like a pair of boots, because he'd had the same boots but he'd outgrown them by two or three sizes but he was still wearing them, but they were all taped up. I said, do you need some new boots? He said, yeah, but it'll be like a year's wage or whatever you know to put aside. I said, come on, we'll go and get you some boots Honestly at put aside. I said come on, we'll go and get you some boots.

Speaker 2: 34:00

Honestly, at the end of that adventure, he, uh, he said I want you to come to my village. We've got something for you. I said, look, I'm going somewhere, I'm going to another country, and what they'd done, they'd, uh, they were going to give me a cow. They were going to give me a cow from the village to say thank you. It's like wow, is this, is this really happening, you know? And so I think that when we live in the western world like we do, it's we're living in like a narrow kind of world, don't we? You go to these places and my god, it's, it's mind-blowing really that they've got, you know. You know what they've got. They've got each other, daz, you know, and that's the thing that comes out. And I was treated like a brother or a son wherever I went. You know. It's like what a privilege, you know. So it's really hard to adjust.

Speaker 1: 34:47

Coming back, Well, I'm sure it's hard to get that cow on the plate as well. Who's this? Ah, it's me, mrs. She doesn on the on the as well. Who's this? It's me, missus. Yeah, she doesn't talk much, um, no, but that.

Speaker 1: 35:01

That that's what I mean, though they, these people, you know, don't don't have anything, they just have each other, and it's it just makes you know. That's why I always like watching, like Anthony Boudain. You know these far off places, you know people would be. They'd give him food first. Yeah, you know, it's just something that they've embedded in you know their society, and I think ours, you know know, we've lost that a bit. You know it's me be me in today's society and, yeah, instead of, like you know, help help each other. Yet there are obviously, we're not all doom and gloom that there's no sense this world they're like it's me that you know with, with, with all this, like you know, self-obsess, obsession, you know taking selfies and all this. You know, when you've got somebody like you know the people I've been reading about that have nothing, yeah, they just enjoy life, they just enjoy life.

Speaker 2: 36:15

They just enjoy I life. They just enjoy it. I think you hit the nail on the head there when you said about it's not all doom and gloom and it isn't. It's just that the good stuff isn't reported. It's just not reported. I mean, our country would fall apart without volunteers. There's literally millions of volunteers propping this country up. It should be national news, you know, but it's just. We don't live in the world that we see on the telly. You know it's very different, but we don't get the good news and I don't know why. Well, there's lots of conspiracy theories as to why. But there's so much good in the world and if we reported that it'd be a different world, it would, it would, it would's the news a lot more.

Speaker 1: 36:59

You know because, yeah, exactly, yeah, yeah, yeah, you know, when you turn the news on, it's just all doom and gloom. It's like you know this person's doing this, this, this happens there's. There's just nothing. I I just remember, like I'm pretty sure, growing up 70s and 80s, the news at least would have something positive on yeah, the 10 o'clock news used to finish with a little funny story.

Speaker 2: 37:24

Yeah, but why does every major story have to be a bad one? You know, I don't get that. I don't get it. You know, there's so many brilliant people in the world doing great things and helping each other. It's, you know, it's just madness that it's to this that we're promoting the negative.

Speaker 1: 37:41

You know, it's some form of control going on, but that's, I don't want to go down that particular rabbit hole again, I always say that's a different podcast, that's a dark web podcast, that web, yeah well, um, I thought it was really great that you're able to kind of enjoy this with your son as well. You know, meeting with his mates.

Speaker 2: 38:04

Yeah, danny came to. I turned 50 when I was in India, so Danny came with me on that trip across India and Singapore and it was just brilliant having him there. And then earlier on was he was traveling through Southeast Asia, you know, doing his backpacking years and I met up with him. Well, surprised him down there. So that was great to meet Danny on the trip and you know, have a kick about with Danny and it's great that he's part of it.

Speaker 2: 38:35

And you know some good friends came out with me for one or two of the games as well. So I'm glad you know they've given their own personal accounts of their journeys in the book as well. So I think majority of games I just set off and did, but I did get support on some of the others you know like later on. Especially, you know we went to Ireland. We went with a couple of a couple of lads and a guy from right to to Hungary and in a couple of countries I went to I knew people when I got there so they were a big help as well, you know. So yeah, and we had an interesting game down in Calais.

Speaker 2: 39:13

We went to the the jungle refugee camp and had a game there, which was, again, you know, an eye-opener, because all we saw on the television at home was all these hordes of guys trying to, you know, smash the lorries, get across the channel.

Speaker 2: 39:29

And they were definitely there, you know they were doing that. But what we saw were thousands of people at night just living in battered tents on sand dunes. But what they'd done is they built a, built their own village out of rubbish. There was a church there, there was a school there, there was cafes there. You know it was. They've been really resourceful and just built this kind of mini mini town and that that wasn't reported anywhere. And when, when we were walking through the refugee camp, we were just met with smiles and offers of cups of tea and conversation, and all the TV cameras were dotted about just facing the floor and waiting for the fires at night and for all the bother, and that was a really good example of, even in the most desperate place, the most amazing people you know, just resilient, friendly, wanting to get to know you. It's like report that Come on.

Speaker 1: 40:26

You know I don't get it, don't get it. That's the thing too. You know, like I said, you know, my dad worked in Saudi, he worked in Iran, he's worked in Iraq and I think the West have this kind of view of these people. My dad said the Kurds are some of the nicest people he's ever met in his entire life. Again, they were given the clothes off their back. The food would always be the guest first. So I think, yeah, there is, there is blindfold there sometimes because, yeah, like you said, you know the the news doesn't report. You know how nice these people are, like you know, not not everyone's out to. You know, get it, get each other, and it's kind of, kind of a sad, sad state. But, um, I wanted to ask you a few questions what, what's the highest elevation? That, uh, city or town, you, you?

Speaker 2: 41:31

uh, that was. That was up in Katmandu, up in the layers up there. Yeah, I met a monk on my 50th birthday. He gave me a roundabout bollocking about a lot of things really, about all the poisons I was carrying and this, that and the other, and I think you were probably right, actually, but that was a great game up there and the sun was there and there's lots and lots of temples.

Speaker 2: 42:04

That was part of the reason to go to Iceland later, because I thought, well, I've been all the way down to New Zealand, so what's the furthest north I've been and I haven't been that far. So I ended up in Iceland for a game, you know, to try and get some, because everywhere I went I was cooking on gas, you know, it was like super hot wherever I went, and so I had a nice trip to Iceland. So, yeah, the highest was definitely Nepal. Yeah, the hottest was Kenya, which is ridiculous For my blue skin, it was just ridiculous. The coldest was Iceland. The maddest was Colombia. I could just, you know, I'd just go on and on really with all these labels really. But yeah, so you know, lots of cultural differences, but fundamental things were the same. People wanted community, friendship, family, you know, and it was everywhere, it was really uplifting, you know, it was really uplifting.

Speaker 1: 43:07

It's crazy to think, because I know Iceland has a massive, massive Liverpool supporters branch as well. So I mean going around the world as well. Did you also like encounter Liverpool supporters?

Speaker 2: 43:22

Yeah, I remember watching a game in New Zealand. I got this guy to open his pub at about four o'clock in the morning. You know, with this time difference, we were watching United-Liverpool. I should have said Liverpool-United Can't put United before Liverpool. And yeah, yeah, wherever we went I was in Japan, liverpool I should have said Liverpool, united can't put United before Liverpool. And yeah, yeah. Wherever we went, I was in Japan and watching the Dortmund game in the early hours there. You know, we had a lot of Japanese Reds and so, and the Iceland it's funny, you should mention the Icelandic Reds. Yeah, I walked in to watch one of our Champions League games in a local pub and I never, never, buy a round in Iceland. It's just unbelievable. It's like 12 quid a pint, and I met all the Reds in there as well. So, yeah, wherever I went, I saw Liverpool fans.

Speaker 1: 44:10

Yeah it's mental. It's mental like just just how far and wise like our fan base is, you know yeah crazy like Thailand.

Speaker 2: 44:21

You know, I came across this footy pitch there and all these kids were playing. They all had their replica shirts, tons of Liverpool shirts, you know, and this was in. It wasn't in Bangkok, it was like a suburb, it was like out there, but they were still there.

Speaker 1: 44:34

You know, it's yeah, huge, huge, yeah so for the book, like, what do you want people to kind of get from the book?

Speaker 2: 44:46

erm well, I, it'd be nice if people get a sense that we're as, as as uh, joe Cox said, the politician that was that was murdered. You know she said there's more that that brings us together than divides us or words, to that extent, and I think if the book helps in some way towards that, that thinking really, you know that it there's, hopefully, it's a really hopeful book and it's a positive book and people can see we're not that different. Wherever you are in the world, people have the same, you know, wants and needs. Really, you know, and I think that we shouldn't be viewing people with such a suspicion, as you know we shouldn't be. If that's our first protocol to view a person with suspicion, then there's a barrier up straight away, as you know we shouldn't be. If that's our first port of call to view a person with suspicion, then there's a barrier up straight away. You know, just just listen and learn and be inspired, you know, uh, by people rather than well, you're different to me. I don't think I'll uh, I don't think I'll bother. You know, um, and and also that it's our, it's our game and it doesn't belong to the Blatters and it doesn't belong to these guys at all. It's ours and go and watch your local grassroots football team.

Speaker 2: 46:05

I've had my brother used to play semi-pro and I had some of the best times of my life watching him play. You know, in cup semi-finals, cup finals watching how a club at that level works and how people fundraise all year round just to keep that club going. You know, that's footy. That's footy. We're just about preserving it at Liverpool, the connection with the fans. You know, when FSG tried to up the the ticket in the main stand to 74 quid, we all walked out on the 74th minute, you know, and they listened. We're kind of clinging on, we're doing all right, but you saw Klopp two weeks ago looking behind him at the main stand saying come on, where's the noise? You know, and it's what you were talking about before, about the brown sandwiches. Oh, I don't know, I fear for us. I do, but and there's a long answer to your to your question there but I hope people really have a good laugh.

Speaker 2: 47:05

I hope they enjoy meeting the people that I met along the way in the book and yeah, and and and if anyone's got a condition like I have, you know, like the asthma, that it needn't be the end of the world. You know, um, you can, you can go further and farther than you think you know, if I mean not everybody can, unfortunately, but a lot of people can. You know it's all up here. You just have to push yourself, push yourself and keep going and see where it takes you. You know, and yeah, and that's about it really, but definitely a positive message that there's brilliant people in this world and yeah, just go out and meet them and yeah, enjoy life while you can.

Speaker 1: 47:51

Well, I mean. The quote that I really like is is as long as there's a banana skins in uganda and 10 cans in lancashire, football will always belong to the people.

Speaker 1: 48:02

Yeah, that's it, that's it yeah, yeah, yeah, I uh, like, like I said, like, I'm halfway through the book and I'm really enjoying it. It's, you know, because I get loads of books, you know, from footballers and sometimes they just go on and on and on and on and you know I can't really get into it. I lose, just, you know. But this you know. Again, if I could have just read it from start to finish, I would. But you know, as I said, life gets in the way with four kids and and it and it's crazy because two of my kids have a lung disease, okay, so they have really bad asthma as well, and so you know, we have to really be careful, like you know, especially with just them, getting the flu is is hard enough. You know, you've got to really like segregate. Okay, you, you two, stay over there and we'll stay over there. And you know, wear the mask and all that stuff. So, yeah, I've got to look out for that, but let's let. I've got to look out for that.

Speaker 1: 49:15

Let's talk about Klopp, let's talk about this Liverpool team. If you would have asked me in August, would we be top of the league? Would we be in a final? Would we be in the sixth round of the FA Cup, would we be in the last 16 of the Europa League? I would have your hand off, especially after last season's.

Speaker 1: 49:39

Just whatever last season was, it was just a hangover, I would say, from the season before. I'm just amazed by this team. I'm amazed by Klopp. He just, you know, even though we all know it's coming to an end and it's going to be a very emotional time, in that last week of the season, you know whether I'm hoping we get to the Europa League final and the FA Cup. You know, like me, mate said he just thinks it's going to be Liverpool, man City and the FA Cup final, just to go. It's going to be emotional.

Speaker 1: 50:21

But what he brings to this team and it's 2.0 Liverpool now, yeah, no way did I ever think four brand new midfielders would come in and hit the ground running like they have, and they came from nowhere. I don't even know who Slobber's Lie was or is. I'd heard of Gravenbatch Endo. No, mcallister was probably the only one. Yeah, and I think we stole him from brighton for 35 million, you know, and people were complaining that we weren't spending 100 million on on players. It's not if people don't know already, we, klopp has a certain player that he wants, and they've got to tick off these boxes, and 100 million is usually not one of them.

Speaker 2: 51:22

Absolutely. Yeah, he just knows, doesn't he? I mean, when there's a clamour for new players in any transfer window, me and Danny do it ourselves. We're guilty about it. Sometimes we're thinking why don't you go for him? Why don't you go for him? He's a perfect fit. But he already knows, he's already got the players.

Speaker 2: 51:40

I mean, our squad now, with all these lads coming back, is just absolutely phenomenal, isn't it? I mean, look at the other day, with a young lad in midfield, kwanzaa, playing like he's been playing forever. You know what would he have done with Jones? He's turned Jones into a player. He was always a good footballer, even when he was in the younger age groups, weren't he? But he's turned him into a man and he's, he's grafted and he's, he looks, he's walking around, but he's using that arrogance in a great way. He's such. He's the best coach in the world for me.

Speaker 2: 52:14

Because, ancelotti, why do you? They can go to these places and take players off the court, peg and just put them in and pay whatever they want. This guy, he just creates magic, doesn't he from he just? I mean, look what he did with with Salih O'Malley. He was a good player, but he left a world beater. Bobby Firmino couldn't get a game out there with Rodgers, one of the best players to ever wear a red shirt. You know, salah, it's a missing print comes back. That's just Klopp. That's Klopp. He's a special man.

Speaker 1: 52:50

I just think a lot of people just haven't learned. Like you, man isn't he? Yeah, I just think a lot of people just haven't learned, like you know. Like you said, I think we've all done it, we've gone, you've got to go get him. You know, we probably all said we need a centre back, we need a defensive. Oh god, yeah, yeah, yeah, but all screaming, and you know he had it covered. I mean, is Endo, like you know he had it covered? I mean, is it? Is endo, like you know, someone you would put in the in your first 11? You know, off the bat, not a chance, you know.

Speaker 1: 53:23

But again, I'm not a world-class manager flop is, you know everyone has opinions, but like, I think, I think, I think some people just want to win, like the transfer league yeah, and that's that's.

Speaker 2: 53:38

That's exactly how United operate. They just go out and buy names and what's happened to them? You know, they're just a mess because they're not a team, they're just individuals, and he doesn't do that, I mean. I mean what he's done with Endo. Before Endo went to the Asia Cup, he was dynamite, weren't he? And when he turned off the fort, hold on a sec. He's going to really struggle with Eric Premier League. You know how's he going to fill that spot? And then, when he was gone, I was thinking I'm blotted.

Speaker 1: 54:07

Endo's going to the Asia Cup, you know, the first few months he wasn't up to speed, but you know, neither was Fabinho. Remember it took Fabinho like four or five months. Same with Robbo as well. He didn't put him in the team until about four or five months and we had to go through. You know Marino, you know who, god bless, you know, wasn't the greatest football player on the planet, but it was Biden his time and I think that's what Klopp gives these players his time, and you can see the confidence.

Speaker 1: 54:42

Look at Gomez. Everybody was writing Gomez off. He's done, he's dusted. Get him out of here. He's having one of the best seasons he's had for probably three seasons. And people forget that that year we won the league. It was him and Virg, yeah, until that. I think it was the Burnley game that he, you know they slid off the pitch and he broke his his leg, yeah, but he was fantastic. And then it's it's footballers need to play on a regular basis and confidence, and Gomez looks like he could play goalkeeper, could play a striker. I mean, when that lad finally gets that first goal, I'm going to be so happy for him, because it's kind of like a, you know, a bit of like F you to the people that just stop believing in him, and I think we've got to stop doing that with footballers. You know, jones, oh, he's only in the team because he's a scouser like you know.

Speaker 2: 55:46

come on, he's in the team because Klopp believes in him you know, yeah, and he books the trend Klopp does, believes in him. You know, yeah, and he books the trend. Clock does, I think, because some player, some manager, I think they're conscious about the noise outside and they'll swap and change players. Chelsea do it a lot, whereas he's done it with Gravenberg lately, but he's not playing his best games, but he's playing every game. He's getting minutes every game and he played 90 minutes the other day and you can see him growing. Now. You can see, all right, there is a player there and to do that at the highest level and try that out.

Speaker 2: 56:19

A lot of managers will balk at that and say, no, you know, we need results, but Klopp's different, isn't he? He's kind of like no, if you don't play, how are you going to get better? And it's quite an old-school approach to modern football, really. You. And it's quite an old school approach to modern football, really. You know, because they've got no other testing ground. They have to do it there. And fair play to Klopp, he's got the balls to do it.

Speaker 1: 56:41

Yeah, well, I mean, that's that We've had 191 changes, 54 more than any other team in the Premier League. It just shows like he's, you know, I'd say August. You know, once we got those players in, people were already starting to look at January going. Who are we going to get in? We need this player, we need this player. And I look at the squad right now, we don't need anyone. Don't need anyone. No, oh, we don't. I mean Connor Bradley. Again, I'm sure people would have laughed and gone nah, you know, if Trent's not in, connor Bradley, nah, he's not going to do it and he looks like he's played there for two years he came on against Arsenal and Martin out of the game, didn't he?

Speaker 2: 57:32

yeah, oh, what a player. I think they all saw that pre-season. And then he got injured, didn't he? And he couldn't start the season. But it's the belief. It's like McConnell. Apparently Clark just said to him just go and play like you're playing on the park. I mean, as a young lad, getting that sort of backing from your managers, you've got to play. And I watched a documentary on Souness last night and they bought him from Middlesbrough and he got to the end of his first training week and he said to Ronnie Moran he says no one's told me anything about where I should be playing or positionally, and all that. And Ronnie Moran gave him waltz. He said shut your effing mouth. He said we bought you because you're a good footballer. That's all you have to do is go out and play football, because that was the Liverpool way. You're good enough. We bought you for that position. Go and play it. You know there's a little echo of that with Klopafi.

Speaker 1: 58:30

Well, we had Jan Molby on and he kind of said the same story. Because he came from Ajax, you know that would be like you've got to do this and this stretch and all this. And he came to Liverpool and he's like, you know, when we're doing the stretching, what's stretching? You get out on the pitch and play your game. And he was just like, okay, you know we all know what Mulby did, but yeah, I just think you know he turned doubters into believers, didn't he? Klopp?

Speaker 1: 59:04

And I think after last season people started to doubt him and I think, you know, I can't imagine, like, what he goes to. You know, we, we, all we see is like fresh dresses with him. We see, you know pictures of him at the training ground and obviously at Anfield and then away. But he lives it 365 days a year. You know, probably 24 hours a day probably wakes up going Liverpool year. You know, probably 24 hours a day probably wakes up going Liverpool. Yeah, and we don't see that.

Speaker 1: 59:39

And I think it's a slap in the face some of these people that are already, like you know, kind of going. Ah, it's got to be FSG. No, why can't you just believe the man that he's tired and wants to spend time with his family. I think we need to stop questioning Again. As a human race, we always have to question is he telling the truth? I don't think Klopp has ever lied once in his life. He just seems down to earth, and when he says he's tired and he needs a break, he's tired and he needs a break he's got real integrity, hasn't he?

Speaker 2: 1:00:18

that's one thing he has got. Yeah, I mean, you know the development of the Anfield road and the Axa training ground. You know it doesn't pay for itself, so we've not always got the money that you know these other teams have got, but we can see where the money's gone. You know, anfield looks fantastic at the moment. The new training ground they've took Melbourne back for the women's team. It all costs money, so we get the infrastructure right. We certainly get the academy right, with the lads that are coming through as well. So the investment's going in the right, isn't it? Yeah, you know it'd be nice to get Mbappé running down the wing. It would. But you know what, if you get the right player in the right position, you know you can play like Mbappé.

Speaker 1: 1:01:00

You can play like that anyway you know, yeah, I just think like we just need to stop and, like you know, and savour these last four months instead of like going, you know, whether you're FSG in or out, just believe the man, just believe what he said, absolutely yeah and that's it, and then enjoy these next four months. You know, I think we all of us have kind of taken it for granted. You know, at the end of the day, I think we all have taken clock for granted and, I think, granted, you know, at the end of the day, I think we all have taken Klopp for granted and I think a couple of years ago, one of my mates said you know, just savour this, this man, yeah, what he's doing. And and I I was, I think I was just too caught up to really realize like he's not just a football manager, he's a human being and he's a damn good one. He's brought me so much joy.

Speaker 2: 1:01:59

Wow From where we were when he got all the players together and ran towards the cup. I think it was a West Brom game, I think we dropped one ball at all, didn't we?

Speaker 1: 1:02:11

We got laughed at by opposing fans as well, like what are you doing? They didn't understand what he was, what he was doing yeah, he was just galvanising the club, weren't he?

Speaker 2: 1:02:23

galvanising the team and the fans together. So, come on, we're in this together. We can do it. And I'll never forget that when Oana got, when we won 5-4 and he when we won 5-4. I thought this is special. This is special. Yeah, we'll miss him. It's a big blow. It's like losing Kenny. That's the only thing that I can relate it to is when Kenny resigned after the Everton game. It feels like that.

Speaker 2: 1:02:52

But the club goes on, you know, and it always will, and he's going to leave us in an incredible place, from where we started yeah, he's not going to do a Fergie, is he?

Speaker 1: 1:03:02

no, absolutely, absolutely. That's the great thing, like I think he just knew, like I'm leaving this club in a good place. You know, we've got all these young players that are coming up. The future looks bright for me to. You know, hand the baton off to whoever it may be Xabi Alonso would kind of be be nice. You know, oh, yeah, yeah, just because he knows the club and we all love him. You know that. Oh, yeah, yeah, just because he knows the club and and we all love him. Um, you know that that's my, my, my best bet, but I don't even want to think about that now. I've got four months of clop. I've got, I've got four months of clop to treasure, hopefully, three, three finals and a a league title. I mean, I'm not asking for much, I'm not asking for much, but you know, even if we don't reach that height, just you know, we all just need to enjoy these last four months of Klopp. Yeah, just enjoy that ride. Yeah, exactly, well, steve, I really appreciate you coming on again. We'll, we'll do this.

Speaker 2: 1:04:13

The plug the book Around the World in 80 Gigs. The Earth Shed Bar Available on Amazon.

Speaker 1: 1:04:20

Yeah and it'll get to you real quick, especially if you have Prime. It got to me in less than 24 hours actually.

Speaker 2: 1:04:28

Did it, oh brilliant.

Speaker 1: 1:04:30

It's an absolutely amazing book. Well, thank you very much, steve Like. Like I said, go buy the book and please like and subscribe and we'll see you next time ¶¶ ¶¶ oh the great, oh the great, oh, oh you.