Football and Music 1:1 with Senior Booking Agent Geoff Meall

Strap in for a nostalgic journey with Geoff Meall, an avid Reds supporter and senior agent at Wasserman Music Limited. Geoff takes us on a fascinating tour of the music industry, starting from his early days as social secretary at Oxford University to his present-day role managing bands. Listen as he paints a vivid picture of the music scene's evolution, peppered with humorous anecdotes about band egos and the art of networking in the modern industry. Get ready for an episode packed with football, music, nostalgia, and a good dose of reality. 

The Liverpool Connection is an LFC podcast that aims to bring the story of our wonderful club to as many fans as possible around the world. The history, the passion, the music, the people, the City – we want to share perspectives on and off the pitch. We're delighted to have you here with us, be sure to Like and Subscribe with Notifications on for our latest podcast.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:09

Hi everyone and welcome to another story episode of the Liverpool Connection podcast. I'm your host, daz. If you haven't checked out our last few story pods, please do. The last one was with Ray Houghton absolutely boss fella. The one before that, I do believe, was our three-year anniversary one with Jan Mulby. Again, I couldn't ask for any better three-year guest. I grew up watching Jan absolutely amazing footballer and just an amazing person. But yeah, please go check that out. Today's guest is Geoff Meal. I might go back and re-edit that. We'll get there in the end. Anyway, geoff is a senior agent for Wasserman Music Limited and I'm going to bring him on to tell his Liverpool story, how he became a dead supporter his first and field match. Then we'll get into the music side. Geoff, welcome to the Liverpool Connection podcast. Thank you. Let's delve in way way. I'm not saying you're that old. It's just a few years ago when you started supporting the dead as a young lad.

Speaker 2: 1:36

Yeah, so born in the late 60s in the south end split family. Dad side were all Liverpool, so can definitely go back trace the Liverpool thing back to my grandfather who used to take my dad and his seven brothers to the game. Mum and side are all blue, so my sister's blue. I obviously got the good end of the stick and obviously got taken to the match by him. That's how the story started. Basically he was a season ticket holder up until the late 70s, early 80s. My first introduction was and he used to tell my sisters not that she enjoyed it very much, but we used to go to all the reserve games. Because back in those days the reserve games always used to take place at Amfield and we'd stand in the paddock which is where his season ticket was All through the 70s probably went to most reserve games for at least five or six seasons because I think that was just a better introduction to football for us. The Darby's in those days used to be great. They used to have about 25,000 people in them as well, so they used to open up all the parts of the ground there.

Speaker 2: 2:45

Then, obviously towards the end of the 70s he started taking me to a few games Would have been probably at 79, I think probably in the first time I was taken. Started going more regularly in the 80s, 81, 82. Then obviously started doing the classic thing of sort of going with my mates and leaving my dad behind, sort of being on about 83, 84. I had a season ticket from 84 to 87 before I went to college.

Speaker 2: 3:14

Obviously I had a bit of a period where I didn't see too many games for 87 through to 92, 93 and then sort of moved to London Obviously started using Contacts to get into games to all mate to mine who still had season tickets and stuff Got lucky to share in the season ticket in the mid to late 90s. I go to Anfield, maybe live in London now but I go to Anfield maybe six, seven times a year but it goes a lot away games. That's kind of where I do now, obviously a lot easier for the London games and I like the Europeanaways and all that sort of stuff really, do you remember your first, not the reserve, but your first team match?

Speaker 2: 4:02

Really weirdly, I can't actually remember what the first one is, which is actually a really shit thing to say, isn't it? That's not what you should do. There's actually one in my programme collection. There's a programme from 81 when we played Brighton, and that would be the first time I remember standing in the Anfield road. That time. My dad had given up his season ticket at that stage so we'd have had to pay on the door. Basically, my first few games with him after we left the paddock would have been in the Anney road end, and then a couple of cop visits and then when they seated the Anfield road end in about 83, we used to get lad and dad tickets a little bit and then ended up going into the cop and maybe a season or two after that, eventually.

Speaker 1: 4:48

Yeah, it's so. Like you know, like my granddad used to take me at my first game without my granddad, I was like Billy Big Balls, I mean you just feel like you've stepped into another header. You're just like it's me now. You know, without looking at, I mean, my granddad still be there, but like we'd go at different times. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and it is.

Speaker 2: 5:16

You know he'd look out for you if you needed any help. But basically you were still sort of you'd gone off with your mates at that stage, basically yeah.

Speaker 1: 5:21

Yeah, you know you'd go down the pub another pint, you know while my granddad, you know, he'd go with all his mates. It was just a time when you're, just like you know now I feel like invincible in it.

Speaker 2: 5:39

So my first. So I actually camped in for my first sort of game, without sort of my daddy probably was there and probably went into a different part of the ground, but so I arranged to meet sort of a bunch of mates from school and we all met. Well, I arranged to meet up on the cuff one European game I think it was the Lech Poznan game in the so it's 83, 84 season and basically we all arrived and none of us met up with each other because we were a bit too naive and stupid and arrived at different times. Then and you know, obviously in a massive, you know, was it 24,000 people standing on the cup in those days, you know. So you know, we all said we'd stand in a similar sort of area and didn't find the next time we all found each other and you know the whole so much going with your mates. The experience took off from them really.

Speaker 1: 6:22

Yeah, it's. You know there was. I mean for me, granddad, you know there was always like a point after the match. It just beat up with me just to make sure you know I was alright and there was no trouble and stuff. Yeah, same with away matches as well. He'd do exactly the same thing. You know, go down on the train with me, yeah, we just go different little sections of the away section and he would just meet me after, just to make sure you know. You know you're all right and, like you know, do you need any money? And it's like usually, yeah, granddad, yeah, totally Pints, yeah, Excellent. So who was your? You know who was your poster? You know, post the player on the ball?

Speaker 2: 7:08

I think the first player I sort of like sort of fell in love with is like the right sort of expression you use these days, but it's er Marlon Hansen. I just I love the class of the man it's, sort of as a defender basically, you know, to then see him sort of play live. I mean, obviously you know he was in the team with Kenny and you know you can't ignore the fact that Kenny was on the pitch. But there was just something about Alan Hansen and the way he sort of, you know, held himself on a football pitch, used to love the way he came forward as well.

Speaker 2: 7:33

You know there's the very classic in the, the five-nil er Guguson away. You know he's sort of like there's a. There's a scene where he just strides out and waltzes past a couple of players and I used to love it when he did that. So he was definitely the first sort of hero. And when I was playing I was always a defender and so you know, sort of like no, I was never tall enough to be a centre back. You know, is er. I mean, you know, definitely that's probably why I gel with him the most.

Speaker 1: 7:59

So is it? Is it safe to say, like your, your team was the 80 team?

Speaker 2: 8:06

Yeah, totally, totally. I mean I've obviously been watching you know through well, for sort of decades now, but I mean, yeah, I was really lucky to, you know, spend a lot of time in well, obviously, I lived in Liverpool, I went to a lot of matches and you know the 85, 86 season, I think I missed three games or something. There was just, you know, 16, 10 and 17, and you know, obviously, the world's your oyster and you know we had a team where you know, sort of it was the greatest season to follow them, wasn't it, you know, and it was amazing.

Speaker 1: 8:35

Yeah, it's, it's. You know, I always have to pinch myself because From that team probably 85 to like 89, you know I've I've been able to interview at least one of them. Yeah, yeah, yeah, because that's some of the best football that I've ever seen. And, you know, apart from, like the Klopp-Eder, you know, last season and for the last, not last season, that's just gone, obviously, but there's all that a few season before that. You know, I think that's the closest to the 80s kind of team that I've ever.

Speaker 2: 9:15

You know, yeah, the only the only other one I've said. You know the Suarez season. You know with you know, brendan, you know that's, that's the closest I think we come, until Klopp came around. You know you could have to go back to that. Yeah, exactly what you say 80, well, 84, so you know, I mean, I remember the 70s side, of course, but you know that would have been more from the television and you know the occasional seeing one of them in the reserve game occasionally. But yeah, the 80s, 80s sides were just what a joy to watch that time was.

Speaker 1: 9:41

Yeah, they were pretty hard men as well. You know, I mean Steve McMahon, rally Weal, even Mollbee, it's just you don't? You don't see that as much like in a Liverpool team? Well, I mean, you're barely able to tackle nowadays, exactly, yeah. But you know, I think, like I've always thought we needed. You know, I still love Fabinho and I wish we had like a, I mean Milner. You know, if James Milner could have come in maybe you know six, seven, eight years younger than what he, what he was when he left I would have loved that, because you know he does his cron. He'll actually know. You know, it's right next to you. And I think, I think that's what we've missed a little bit, I think in the in the club editing. That's just my opinion. I'm sure people are like you know, nah, we haven't missed that, but I just missed the crunching tackles.

Speaker 2: 10:43

I mean, we grew up, we grew up on it, didn't we? It was amazing. I mean, the players you mentioned in there Mollbee, you know, I mean what a fucking player he was. You know, it was just you know the again sort of. I remember when he arrived there was a little sort of settling in periods, which obviously happens to a lot of players, but once he settled in he was just, you know, he was just a dream to watch and I was there when he scored the goal against United, you know, in the in the league club, which you know. Then we took his 20 years before we got to see it again. You know the story of that and you know I still remember it, you know, sort of as the hardest thing I've ever seen. I've ever seen a player hit a ball, you know, into a goal, it was incredible Tumbled down the clock, the car, you know, sort of further than I've ever tumbled, sort of. You know, before you know, ended up, sort of you know, 50, 60 yards ahead of where we were standing. It was incredible.

Speaker 1: 11:28

Yeah, it's mental how he actually told me the story. You know he had the video tape. Yeah, nobody knew apart from I don't know how it got out.

Speaker 2: 11:42

It was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was it was it was it was. Because they were, they were accordingly for a training purpose as well. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 11:47

Yeah, yeah. And then somebody had found found out later on and asked Jan, don't you have a tape of that goal? And he was like no, no, no do you. And then I see, you know, he just said, like you know what's the harm? Like I mean, because my granddad was at that match as well, you know, and I I didn't see the goal, I didn't go to the match, and he told me about it and just, I mean, just watching it on the video tape on YouTube doesn't do any justice because, as you just described, my granddad said it took it, took the net off.

Speaker 2: 12:27

Yeah, I remember. Actually I remember reading the papers the next day. So for some reason my dad used to buy it as a scout. I never understood. He used to buy the Daily Express, which is the weirdest paper in the world, but he liked the M Quistinger. Yeah, they liked the word searching. He just bought a paper for that reason and I remember sort of reading and thinking Gary Bailey sort of actually said it was the hardest shot he's ever faced and he said, had I got more of a hand to it, it would have taken his fingers off. Is what he thinks. You know. I mean it was like, yeah, it's just great to see it again. You know, yeah, definitely, amazing memory, that goal.

Speaker 1: 12:58

It reminds me, you know, a little bit of John Arnavisa, like he had a rocket and that's all he's told. Against United yeah, you know, nearly took the roof off. Those are the kind of goals like I love. Their little mazy runs, yeah. But when a player hits it from, you know, 25, 30 yards out and the goalkeeper dives like two minutes later just for show, just to make it look like you know the great, the great thing about that goal it was.

Speaker 2: 13:29

It starts with a crunching tackle. As he goes through, white side takes the ball off him, Does a mazy runner rocket it. Basically Everything you love about football in that one goal yeah it's amazing, 100 per cent.

Speaker 1: 13:40

Yeah, I mean, if the if the listeners haven't checked out the MOLBY versus man United goal, that's on YouTube and yeah, it's a cracking goal. So in the 90s, you know, not a very good, very good time for Liverpool, yeah, you know, taking over, that didn't didn't work, you know. And then, towards the later end, you had Evans did OK, and then Hulier, you know the double, the double managerial, which obviously just did not work one bit. I don't know who came up with that. It was a terrible decision. I think both men knew it was wrong, you know. You know, thanks to Roy Kahnus stepping away, I think, you know, probably, you know, to this day, it probably eats at him. I would say, you know we had.

Speaker 2: 14:41

I mean that side was amazing coming forward but they just couldn't defend. And you know, obviously you know I mean it's like the biggest cliche ever, but it was true, you know they just everything he tried to do in defense, couldn't they? But what an exciting team coming forward all the time. You know it was actually a great side to watch, you know, and so obviously you know the players that came out of that side as well. But yeah, defense was just never always thing, was it?

Speaker 1: 15:04

Well, I mean, you know in the first, like Brendan years, same exact thing going forward. We're absolutely amazing and that it was more, more of the. We can score more goals than you know. It was great. It was great to watch at some, some times but, you know, many a time, you know you're biting your nails just like how was this going to end?

Speaker 2: 15:31

I mean, oh yeah totally Even, even to an up, you just go yeah, no, we haven't got this, you know, I mean, it's like you know, a number of times people, people came back at us all the time.

Speaker 1: 15:39

That's what happens, you know, when we play Palace. We needed, we needed about 10 goals. We're three up and, you know, ends in a three, three draw. But you know, it was just that love of like Suarez mentality is a fighter and he's, you know, when we're three, no love, it's one of those you just want to take your foot off the break. But he was just like come on, we can do this and I'm going no, no, how are we going to score 10? Yeah, it was just mental bit, you know, and it's. It's crazy to me, to All. All you know the players that we've listed, that the Maldives, suarez, we've just had amazing players for this team. You know, even in dire situations the 90s, we still had really good players. Yeah, thousands. You know, I mean Owen. You know, great player, you can say what you want about. You know where he went to. You know the Majid and then United. Yeah, again, to watch that little lads on the pitch. Yeah, it's phenomenal.

Speaker 2: 16:54

Yeah, I was there when he made his debut in the Wimbledon game at the end of the season of Palace, basically, and you know, he sort of he was fighting for a penalty and he was just, yeah, you saw something was going to happen with that kid as well, you know. So I mean, he only did give us three or four amazing years and then, you know, just said what came afterwards, really isn't it.

Speaker 1: 17:11

Well, I mean, as they say, the grass is is an always green on the other side, and it didn't really happen for him. I didn't mind joining Newcastle, yeah, but it was when he joined United. I was just like I'm not having that. No, no, no shit. Well, I mean, it's strange, you know, even when you play for Liverpool, then you go across the park. You know, and there has been quite a lot and I don't understand that. You know it's either you can play for Liverpool or you play for Everton. Not, not, not both.

Speaker 2: 17:48

Not both. Yeah, I think some footballers have different mindsets than we do as fans, not we. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 17:55

I mean quite a few of them, especially these days. You know, there's no, like I would say, love for the club. There's no affinity to stay at one club. I mean we've had Gerard and we've had Kada, have been one club players. You never hear about that these days. It's long gone. It's about the money. Or it's about the money I mean, for me, harry Kane has been one of the best strikers on the planet. He's up there with the best of England, but he's won nothing. Maybe this is the season where he's finally going to. He's adding off of.

Speaker 2: 18:47

There's a lot of chatter about that over here. Maybe I have to buy him. I think that's one of the biggest bet, I think of the minute.

Speaker 1: 18:56

Yeah, well, I mean, that's another one. They get one over on Levy because he's an astute businessman. So he certainly is. He doesn't have to give away Kane for basically peanuts. So that's our goal. Probably go on till the last day of the transfer window. So what have been some of your favourite matches that you've gone to?

Speaker 2: 19:31

I've gone to loads of finals. Obviously I was at Istanbul. I've been at everyone since Most of the FAQ finals since the 80s. I only missed the Wimbledon game, which was actually quite a lucky one to miss. My favourite game of all time remains, I think, but anyone who was there was when we played United in the semi at Goodison in 85.

Speaker 2: 19:52

It was being at Goodison taking over the Gladys Street was something that obviously we never. It was a novelty. It was a match played against the background of when football rivalry was just so intense. It was like those years where it was dangerous to go to a football game sometimes. And that match people will tell you there was a lot of hard men spending time doing things that they probably might not be overly proud of or maybe still proud of. Outside the ground. We were a miles better team than they were.

Speaker 2: 20:27

The match kicked off, they played much better than we did, they scored. We were terrible. And then we equalised in the last minute, which is always one of the greatest things with that sort of great, runnywheeling, curling goal. You know Q pandemonium, we're in the Gladys Street sort of, you know sort of limbs, as they say now these days, everywhere we go into extra time, as you did in the FA Cup. In those days the game carries on exactly the same spirit. They score again, you know. So they're winning, and then we equalise again in the last minute of injury time. And that is just. I still you know it's going to be goosebumps. Now, sort of I had my glasses punched off my face, bizarrely, southern flying the air in this madness, and I might actually pick them up off the floor completely untouched, which is just I don't know how that happened. And yeah, just that system right. Just, you know, to equalise once in the last minute is amazing, you know, scoring the last minute is amazing, but to equalise twice against them in that atmosphere at that place was just. It just remains still my sort of, you know, favourite moment in football, I think. Sadly, we then went to Main Road three days later and got beat sort of to an ill by them and sort of you know they went on to sort of play ever in the Cup final because that's where we were due to go.

Speaker 2: 21:39

You know some of the other great matches I mean obviously Istanbul, you know, sort of you know I'm sure I'm not alone in saying what incredible sort of you know long day that was. You know it was. You know I had to. I flew from Luton at like I think I played in Left of 5am so I was up there at 2am and you know, obviously you know the longest day ever of sort of drinking and then up in the. You know the trip to, you know, 50 miles away from sort of the city centre and all the madness that happened there, the terrible first half, the comeback, the penalties, and then you know the longest trip ever back to the airport and getting back to England. You know I think I was up for like over 24 hours. That sort of day. You know, small sleep on the airport. Four the 86 Cup final. Again, you know, obviously, again you know the sort of the, you know the excitement of obviously playing on almost as I final, when you know the actual atmosphere between the two teams at that stage was pretty decent. You know, obviously, again to go one-nil down and then make an amazing comeback. You know it was just. You know I had to win the double.

Speaker 2: 22:47

That same season I had the joy of being at Leicester City the penultimate game of the season when Everton were running up. We're about to win the league and they needed to lose against Oxford and we needed to win the next two games for us to win it. And exactly that happened, basically, which is, you know, just you know, I think, oxford, you know Oxford United, in the top division. It's so bizarre, isn't it? But I think they scored like the 81st minute. So obviously you know that last nine minutes of our game, you know, at the same time as theirs, was incredible.

Speaker 2: 23:18

So, yeah, I mean, yeah, I've been lucky to be at a lot of big games over the years and I was at the end the five-nil it's a fact that last game Ever went to my doubt before he died the Forest five-nil, which is one of the greatest performances from that mid-80s side sort of going as well. So, and yeah, over the last three years, you know I've had some amazing times Again. You know the Suarez season, you know that was, you know, the, the full game where we sort of scored in the last couple of minutes, you know, to keep the sort of the run going. And, yeah, what some of the stuff I've seen with Klopp over the last three years has been absolutely amazing as well.

Speaker 1: 23:54

Yeah, it's like for me. The away adventures, yeah, you know, just especially you know now that we're in the Europa League, you know people are a bit pissed off and you know this football club needs to be in the elite champions, yeah, but we're in Europa League, we're in it to win it. But you get to go to. You know, we don't know yet, but yeah, I'm sure away supporters will get to go to places that have never been before and it's part of the adventure. And you know, even though, like you know, you've got to take a boat, you know car taxi, whatever you're playing, you know that's part and parcel of it.

Speaker 1: 24:43

And you know that's one thing that I do miss, that you know I don't get to do the away matches, obviously, and when I'm home I go to home matches, but the away matches, you know it's too much for me, but for yourself, you know, you say like last for the last season, yeah, how much tougher season that we've had ever before. But yet the away fans just singing the heart out every single time If you go. I just wish sometimes people on Twitter would just stop just complaining and maybe go on YouTube and just watch an away match and just watch the away fans. I'm just so proud of them. They really just embody everything about Liverpool football. You could be having the crappiest of seasons still singing.

Speaker 2: 26:04

I've been around for a long time so I've seen a lot of up and downs. I started when it was only ups and then the downs came, and the last few seasons we got the ups again and a season like last year. You just had to take it in its stride. At the start of this calendar year I saw us lose at Bremford Wolves, brighton. It was just like the two draws of Palace and Chelsea, where we played awful. I still do it every season until I'm not able to, because I love it. I love being with my people and having that sort of thing in your soul that we can't explain what it is. But we go along and we take the bad times with the good times. Luckily, we've had some good times recently.

Speaker 1: 26:54

We want more good times, obviously, but that's football for you. You get the highs and then you get the lows. Let's go into football and music go hand in hand. Football, music and fashion go hand in hand. You're part of the music business. I saw some of the bands that you've looked after, but you know Muse, paramore, zutons, who I absolutely love. How did you plan a career in the music side of things?

Speaker 2: 27:37

Not really. I just basically ended up leaving Liverpool in 1987 and went to college in Oxford. I actually went to Oxford Poly in Oxford University and got myself involved in the entertainment scene where there were a few bands coming through and playing. I ended up becoming a social secretary at the uni. I started buying bands that we were doing once a week of agents, which is what I am now. Basically, I didn't even know what an agent was like most people don't If you're not involved in live music and at the end of my year of doing that at college, I applied for a few jobs in the music industry because I thought this is where I want to be.

Speaker 2: 28:22

Luckily, one company said we've got a spot for a trainee. I shipped myself to London on an absolutely ridiculous low wage. I struggled for quite a few years. That was the toughest time to go to football because I couldn't really afford to. I rent, never mind going football trips. I just picked up some experience in learning how to book bands and how to sign bands. First you sign them, then you book them. It's the mantra of what our job is about.

Speaker 2: 29:00

This was probably the early 90s. I started to discover a couple of bands that started to break through. I was around at the time when my career was developing, around the time Brickpop developed. I started looking after quite a few of the Brickpop bands Jeans, subferri, animals, things like that, biss, sidewild. That started the first levels of successful band booking I did I was late 90s to stubborn news and was with them for almost 20 years, basically until a couple of years ago. It's an interesting job. I get to travel around the world. I get to do things a lot of other people do. But don't be fooled, it's not as glamorous as it might sound. It's mostly tied to a computer. It's mostly sending emails and doing logistics and negotiations and learning, knowing about European tax rules and European visa rules and shit like that. It's very dealing with egos and bands and having to book bands and festivals. It's an interesting life. I don't think I've changed it, but I certainly couldn't change it now because I've been doing it for nearly 30 years.

Speaker 1: 30:21

That's crazy. We talk about football as with egos, bands definitely, especially frontmen. Some of the riders that I've seen because I DJ as well, but me and my mates used to book top DJs and some of the riders were just like you, having a laugh. What are some of the craziest riders that you've seen for a band?

Speaker 2: 30:54

There's two ways that that happens. You get the ego rider, where you get some artists who will put ridiculous things on riders because they're ridiculous people and their expectations of how they should be treated is how the world works. You do get a lot of bands who will do a joke rider for the fun of a rider. There's a classic E-pop rider where it's online and their tour manager is blatantly taking the pace and sets people on a ghost hunt. If you find this one thing, you've got to find another thing. There's a bit of that, but it's funny.

Speaker 2: 31:41

It's actually changed as well, I think, from the 70s, 80s into the 90s, when the music business was a lot more rock and roll and access was more normal than it is now. It's people are professionalized or not. One of the things people have realized if you're a successful band and you put something on a rider, at the end of the day you're paying for it because it comes out of the show costings. If you ask for somebody to drive you in a Rolls Royce, you're fucking paying for that. So don't is what most people have learned now.

Speaker 1: 32:17

For you being still in the industry, for your take on things, because music is just a bit like fashion as well it comes and then goes. It comes, Obviously, Brit pop was massive in the early 90s 2000s. You had late 90s, the grunge.

Speaker 2: 32:45

New metal as well in that period as well.

Speaker 1: 32:50

Yeah, but nowadays a lot of this pop stuff is just commercialized. I love it when I discover new bands, that little spark, the little shining your eye and you just like, these are going to go far. How do you like, like, look at a band, do you go see them first?

Speaker 2: 33:22

Yeah, pretty much. I mean, I think so because I'm sort of like a 30 year old I think we call ourselves veterans, now agent. You know I have a reputation. People know who I am in the industry. You know people know you know what I can do historically, what sort of bands I could do like you know people do specialising different genres of music. Sort of my history of sort of what everything I've done is basically guitar based. You know I've dabbled occasionally in all the other worlds but you know I don't know anything about sort of EDM music. I mean, I know what EDM music is but I don't know how to book it. I like hip hop. I've never worked hip hop artists and things like that. So what would happen is the majority of stuff that I sort of you know would be interested in starting a relationship with and sort of dealing with would come from either people approaching me because they know who I am and they sort of want to do it, or somebody I know would be the one tipping me that you know this is. You know this is something you should look at. You should talk to this person. So you know there's a lot of networking going on and that you know I don't have to do what I would have had to do, sort of.

Speaker 2: 34:25

You know, as I started my career and you know, go out seven nights a week trying to discover bands. I mean the world has changed anyway. You know discovery is now done on a computer, you know. I mean it's like so you know, obviously.

Speaker 2: 34:35

You know when we were growing up, you know the only way you could hear a record was if you bought it, take it or somebody played it on the radio. Now we can listen to anything at any time, you know. You know sort of from our phone or from our computer, you know. So the trends have changed. You know things, the way the speed of the music industry has changed, the way sort of bands develop has changed. But you know the principle of what we still do is live music. We're still booking shows, gigs and concerts for and festivals for our artists. And we still have to find artists who are new and help them develop their career and keep them going. And you know I have artists you know I've taken on three weeks ago and I have artists I've looked after for 25 years. So it's always a balance basically.

Speaker 1: 35:19

Yeah, it just seems just such a tough business, you know, because you can have one great gig and you can bomb and just like you know they're done. I mean I didn't even like how like kind of the BBC wrote about Louis Capaldi, you know a quitshow, his, you know his vocals weren't good. I mean, you know the lad has a turret tick, yeah, but that could have been just some upcoming band you know had the same issue as Louis and then people read, you know online and then they'll go, yeah, he must be shite, yeah yeah, I mean, in fact it's the actual.

Speaker 2: 36:08

I mean he's one of our clients as well, but the coverage over here was actually maybe better than it was in the stage for you. There was definitely a sympathetic sort of you know, sort of you know view from the press. You know what had happened and how he did. I think he will come out of it, you know, obviously after he has a rest and so it's mental health in a better place. You know, I think he will have a rest.

Speaker 2: 36:29

I think we, the industry sort of you know from when I started in the 90s has definitely got better. You know still needs to improve more. You know, looking after sort of artists and stuff. I mean artists are highly strong people. You know they sort of you know they. If you want to be a lead singer, you've got some thing in your head in the first place and sometimes what then happens to you success or not success, you know will affect you in ways that you know nobody expects as well. And I think the other thing, you know the industry's got better, but it still has a lot of you know can still be better all the time.

Speaker 1: 36:59

So I think like for me, a great story is Jamie Webster, yeah, singing Liverpool songs. You know, obviously, that got him through the door, but you know it's his talent, you know he deserves like everything or the praise possible and then to be playing actually this weekend Since tonight 24,000 people.

Speaker 2: 37:26

He saw that really easily as well.

Speaker 1: 37:28

Yeah, he ahead is just you know. I've known Jamie for a couple of years now and he, just you know he's down to earth. You know how some, some bands, the lead singers, just become absolute pricks. You know, jamie will know.

Speaker 2: 37:45

I'm saying nothing basically.

Speaker 1: 37:47

Yeah, mom's the word. No, exactly. So who's a good upcoming band that's on your kind of roster?

Speaker 2: 38:00

Well, if you want to, you know I've got a couple of things I've just taken on sort of like. Really recently I've seen on Australian band called the Terries who sort of started to break Australia and I think there'll be a global story about them. Sort of good little guitar band got half sort of looks like a bit punky attitude but sort of you know also played sort of quite melodic music. It's like sort of feeling quite sort of confident about them. Well, so I just started working with that's always the hardest question you can ever ask a booking agent who you're working with, because we're always. We're always working with whatever we do.

Speaker 2: 38:34

I do a lot of sort of like indie guitar. I do a lot of rock and metal things as well, and I've just started working with the Japanese band One OK Rock, which is selling loads of tickets and feel really confident about them. And yeah, you know it's just the hardest question. You've just asked me there. So whether there's an equivalent question, you can ask anyone in the other industry. But we always forget who we represent as well. I think I represent about 60 bands at the moment and I'm only looking after their live career. You know the managers look after the other aspects of it and we usually collaborate with the managers to put together a strategy of how we sort of see their live work go. You know, we do have relationship with the artist. We don't see them. You know. We meet them, usually at a pitch and things like that Basically.

Speaker 1: 39:18

So yeah, so how you know, Jordan, the COVID time must have been obviously really hard for yourself, and it was awful.

Speaker 2: 39:30

It was like we were the first industry to close and we were almost one of the last industries to reopen. You know so you know for the reasons that people did what they did. You know, obviously live music shut down because you know you talk about social distancing and gathering of people. You know, the only way you can do music successfully is in that environment. So March 2020, you had two or three bands on the road and one band who was sort of the American band the Ex-Ambassadors were on tour in Europe Towards the end of February. They were due to play an Italian show on the tour and that got cancelled. And then we rolled into, we rolled past into Vienna where they played. They went up through Germany and played a couple, I think, a show in Austria then and then got to Poland, loaded into a gig in Kedansk and then were told that they couldn't play because the Polish authorities that night decided to close everything down. So they rolled onto Lithuania for the next show, which was a day off. The promoter was ensuring that they could play the next day, and then Trump, for all his wisdom, decided, you know, he was going to close the borders to everybody. So they then had to fly home. So they, you know they lost thousands, tens of thousands of pounds on the tour income and you know that kind of happened to loads of people. And then nobody was able to do any gigs anywhere globally, outside of a couple of rogue things like Australian bands were able to tour Australian. Kiwi bands were able to tour New Zealand, but you know there was a couple of social distance things which made no money for anybody. You know a lot of hard work until the UK opened at the end of July 2021. So you know we were closed for like 15 months.

Speaker 2: 41:23

You know a company we had to sort of, you know make a lot of people redundant, put a lot of people on furlough, had to work out. You know how you deal with. You know our income is predominantly from the commissions that we make, from artists playing, playing, and then obviously that tap was turned off completely. So yeah, it was yeah, an awful period. Not want to live through that again and coming out of it is also there's lots of challenges. You know you're probably sort of wearing other industries that the supply chain has fallen over. You know there's not enough people around to. You know, do sort of roadwork, crew work, security people are just missing. You know it's taken a long time. Costs are astronomical. So you know bands who've previously made money on tours are not making money now because you know they're spending all the money on the cost of the shows. So it's yeah, it's tricky. You know the superstars will always do well and they're still doing well. Superstar festivals are doing well, obviously. So I go to Glastonbury.

Speaker 1: 42:22

Well, you know there's positives but there's a lot of challenges, since yeah, I listened to a no Gallagher interview and you know he just said you know if you're a singer songwriter, and well, you know, obviously he was established before COVID. He said it was just good to him because he was able to just write.

Speaker 2: 42:42

Yeah, he's totally different. I mean, I had a number of bands who were, you know, breaking at the time as well. And you've seen, you know when you start breaking, everything has to move at the same time, because you know it's like, you know it's like a rollercoaster. I can't think of the way I'm looking for, but you know everything sort of moves along and you know you get bigger step by step and all of a sudden all these artists who weren't able to play for 15 months you know the world moves on and people who you know into new things. So bands who would have previously rode a different type of wave, you know were not able to ride a wave. So I've seen a lot of people's careers damaged by what happened in that period as well.

Speaker 1: 43:17

Yeah, it's tough to recover. You know, I can't imagine being in a band and then just about breaking and then you've got two years of not doing nothing. Yeah, something. That's the best thing, I think, for a band is to be on the road yeah, to people, you know, because that's you know digitally, you know you can correct people's vocals and you know everything sounds pristine. But when you're out on the road that's raw, you know. That's when you know that I think when a band is really good, when you're just like, that sounds pretty close to what the album sounds like.

Speaker 2: 44:03

And the excitement in the room. You can't replicate that. You know people did a lot of streaming gigs and things like that and you know some people got it right, A lot of people got it wrong, but it just, you know, never reciprocated. What a live event is? You know it's like. You know it's a social gathering of people coming together to, you know, have a communal experience with sort of an artist and something that they love. You know, and when that didn't happen, you know bands couldn't move forward.

Speaker 1: 44:26

So let me ask you this I usually ask the musician guest this bit Top if you were to put on a festival, who would your headliner be on a Friday, saturday and Sunday? Alive or dead, or, or you'd like to do all of them, it doesn't matter. Yeah, alive or dead. Alive or dead, all right, all right.

Speaker 2: 44:45

But if I was, I'd probably. I'd probably have an old database. I'd obviously I'd love to see Queen again. I saw them in 86, the last show at Nebworth. I'd love to see Bob Marley. I never got to see Bob Marley. Who would be the third? The first two are really easy, aren't they? Basically Maybe the third, I'd be all selfish and I'd put a lot of bands I'd work with and put them together and sort of have a day where I could sort of chill out because it's already sorted out basically. So that might be where I went.

Speaker 1: 45:17

You've got to stick up for your band, so yeah.

Speaker 2: 45:22

I guess I would have wanted to see the Beatles, you know, and so obviously I do know a few sort of old-age in Liverpool who did have that experience, you know, I mean, but obviously way, way before my time, obviously.

Speaker 1: 45:33

That's the same with me, grandad, you know he got to see him and I'm just like man, you know, because I'm a massive Beatles fan. You know they, just four of them together, were just magical, you know, yeah, totally. And then you know, obviously, john Lennon, you know, kepp going Paul, kepp going Ringo does this thing, yeah, totally, I mean the gods did his. But yeah, I mean, for me it'd be the Beatles. And I never got to see Queen either. I mean obviously got to see Live Aid and that was just probably the best. What 20 minutes I've ever, ever seen. I mean, what a show. You know I love me Liam Gallagher. He's rock and roll. I don't care what people say, I still like him. He's just, he just is rock and roll to me. But like Thready was a showman, he was rock and roll, he was a showman.

Speaker 2: 46:31

Even as a massive Queen. But I've never been able to go and watch any of this sort of. You know, the version they did with Paul Rogers and now the version with Adam Lamar. I've got no interest, I just couldn't see it. It's like, you know, and I know people love it and I've, you know, good fair play to them for sort of carrying on, and so I'm doing the level success they have. But yeah, I've no interest to me.

Speaker 1: 46:49

Yeah, it's a bit, it's a bit camp. You know, the new one with Adam, it's just you like, it's just not Queen Without Thready. You can't ask Queen, just can't. You know, just, if the Beatles and John or Paul had left, it wouldn't be the Beatles, it just wouldn't. Yeah, I mean, all for it for people want to go see it, but yeah, not for me. So come all the way back around. You know we're in a time, we're in clop era. You know we have a few more seasons left. James Pears said looks like 26 will be his last, so we have a few more seasons. We have watched some of the best football. You know I've ever seen. That front three of Mane, mordy and Salah were just absolutely world class.

Speaker 2: 47:47

Especially on the 1920s season, you know, which obviously was sadly curtailed. But I mean, fucking I what I run, that was up until that that Wofford game, which I was sadly at as well actually. But you know I saw a lot before the Wofford game, it's, like you know, to enjoy.

Speaker 1: 48:02

Yeah, it's just you know again. You know we I think we've taken things for granted a little bit with the clop and the team. And you know a lot of old, older mates of mine have said you know, just enjoy the moment, you know. I mean, yeah, you can say we only won one league in 30 years, which again, as a you know big club as we are, we should be winning more obviously. But we've also been up against a juggernaut in City, you know.

Speaker 1: 48:41

A cheating juggernaut yeah, I'm allowed to say that on here, aren't I?

Speaker 2: 48:44

Yeah, why not? I suppose both of us might get sued for that, but it's like you know, yeah.

Speaker 1: 48:52

Yeah, I mean we talk about 115 charges against them. There was charges for UEFA as well. They were able to, you know, get out of that and you know we've just been up against that. You know, lost lost the league by a point. You know came close to winning the champions league. I thought we had a better side against Madrid. You know we just caught on the break. You know it happens in football.

Speaker 2: 49:22

And caught on having the game of his life as well.

Speaker 1: 49:24

obviously, yeah, I mean he's a world-class goalkeeper, but again he there was. It just seemed like it was an hour day there was, he was. Stop it, anything but how. What do you feel that we need to do? Obviously, I just think it was one of those perfect storms last season, playing all the games that we can this season before and messing out on the league by a point to Madrid, and then barely a pre-season yeah. Then those early injuries to our field and then the World Cup. You know, they're not. They're not excuses. I don't. I don't call them excuses, I call them facts because it is a fact. All those are factual things that happened, yeah, what.

Speaker 1: 50:19

What do you think? Like we brought in McAllister, which you know it's looking like probably the bargain of the season when you look mounts gone for 60. Have it is for 65. Declan Rice is 105. Obviously the English tax there. Well played West Ham, you know. Well played to them for sticking to the guns, but for 35 McAllister walks into our team like almost immediately. For me, yes. Do you think we need a massive rebuild? Or just at least another two players who I would say.

Speaker 2: 51:00

I would say to do. We obviously need more sort of, you know, defensive cover. You know obviously this sort of. You know. You know we have obviously first-class sort of fallbacks with. You know I think Simic has on his day is a great replacement, but I think they didn't have the best season and you know I'm not sure if he's actually gonna stay on. But you know I don't think there's too much. We've got behind sort of on the fallbacks there at all. Center backs didn't have a great season last year but obviously you know we know what they're capable of when they, when they can play.

Speaker 2: 51:28

I'd like to see definitely you know one or two brought in sort of, as you know, sort of cover or development sort of there I'd love to go through the next season with a sort of fully fit function in midfield. You know we, as you say those facts, you know we, we didn't last season. You know we had a bunch of sort of players you know like in Milton's case. You know he probably wouldn't have played the way he would have played if the other people had been injured and you know he could have been used in a very different way. You know he's, I mean you know the full-on game at the beginning of the season. To me he was the man of the match, people. He came on in the 65 minute because he calmed everything down and that's that's what he was. He was good at, I think, for being I had a really bad season. You know, I don't think Klopp expected him to fall off the cliff sort of like quite what he did. Hopefully it's an I can't say that word anomaly. I think I got it there, you know, and he may come back. He definitely played better towards the end of the season than he did at the beginning of the season, but was such an influential player in the seasons before that. You know, if McAllister can sort of, you know, bring strength in, I'd still like to see, you know, one or two more midfielders. You know the forward line. I think we're happy.

Speaker 2: 52:36

I'd love to see sort of Nunes settle down. I've had a theory about him at the beginning of last season when he started playing I thought I thought he was like half sort of Slatan and half Ronnie Rosenthal, and there was a period in the season where he was like 90% Ronnie Rosenthal and 10% Slatan. He's like it's either a worldy or a sort of miss on the goal line. You know I mean, but I mean he's obviously a raw talent. Gack Pope, you know, came in at the worst period and you know we played him in years and looked like, you know, like he was a terrible fit, but man, did he settle down and you know, is he, I think he's somebody who you know he's, we're gonna play around his style a lot next year.

Speaker 2: 53:13

Salah didn't have his best season, still put in 22 goals, you know, and you know he's still, you know he's still young and fit and, you know, capable of, you know, coming back into form. So you know, with the squads there, it needs a bit of work, you know, to sort of make it a little stronger and we've got to get rid of the mistakes that we made last season. But you know I'll put some of that down to everything you're saying. You know we, we were running on sort of empty by the time the end of the season before came. You know the short break, the world cup in the middle of you know a lot of things conspired against us in the injuries. So you know I'd put that behind. You know cops, definitely the man to sort of. You know know how to fix it and I'm sure that there is. You know, for all of my moaning on my a little, what's that group with big time? He's part of, you know.

Speaker 1: 53:57

I'm sure there is sort of work going on to try and sound somebody else, you know so yeah, that's the thing I think you know with the whole FSG thing and it's just left a bad taste in people's mouths. You know, not bringing in a midfielder last last well, we did. But you know, we all know how that turned out with mellow, you know just absolutely it's an easy question in years to come, isn't he basically sort of you know?

Speaker 1: 54:26

yeah, probably. How many ministers mellow play, you know, I mean it's it's not his fault. I mean a lot of abuse was at him, not his fault that he was doing extra training. He got injured and it was a bad one. So you know we should live and learn, but I think there's just a bad taste in people's mouths. I mean we already brought him a callus before the window even opened. I think he's quite a lot of our fan base now. You know like, where's the next one? Where's the next one?

Speaker 2: 54:58

yeah, I've always. I've got, you know again, sort of the arguments we have on a water group, but I've also got a theory that I'm definitely not angry in any shape with Coppato but I also think some of it is down to him because I think he is so definitive in the type of players he wants and you know he waited for van Dijk, he waited for Allison, you know which, you know, to the detriment of half a season before van Dijk arrived. We, you know our defense was a shambles until that happened. Basically, and I just think he's, I think you know he, he won't ever settle for, you know, a stopgap, you know where maybe last season would have been the time it would have been beneficial. But you know he's only after definitive players to fit systems that he wants to play. And you know, maybe it was a bit of sort of tightness from FHG, but equally, but you know I think part of it is clock. You know wasn't gonna buy a player he didn't want.

Speaker 1: 55:47

Yeah, I know, I agree, and he can't be stubborn, you know. Yeah, we should have let a few players go the season before Oxen. Yeah, 100% should. It should not have been at the end. You know, in the squad last season, I mean, I think I saw a stat where they barely played seven games between them, which is just horrendous, you know, and so on. And for me, you know, I am starting to think of like Tiago as a luxury player now, because they play more than 25 games a season. Which scenes. But you know, I just I have belief, I'll always have belief in this, in this squad. You know, if we've had horrible squads before and we still believe we are still Liverpool football club, I still think we can compete against City. You know our personal I've spent a lot of money already. You know Chelsea how in hell they've spent 600 million is just beyond me, you know no, no understanding of that whatsoever.

Speaker 2: 56:54

You know, I mean it's a bit elix, he looks like their owner is insane. You know, I mean it's just like. You know, it's just yeah, which, you know, I would love nothing more than to sort of see that. Have them relegated us, you know, but by his madness, you know, and I mean finishing 12, that's not that far off, it is it? You know?

Speaker 1: 57:10

exactly so. You know, money doesn't always buy you. You know what you want. I trust in clock, as I know you do. I know a lot of listeners do as well. You know. We just have to believe. I think we'll go again if we can get these players bedded in. I think we'll challenge.

Speaker 2: 57:27

I would really do and I say and I say and if we do keep him, I think you know if a back on form for being you know is, you know he's you know he was, you know, for a while he was the best defensive midfielder in the league, and then last season he wasn't, you know, and it made a hell of a difference to everything that happened to us last season yeah, I just think we you know they needed to go away.

Speaker 1: 57:48

I still find it in insanity that some of these players are still playing internationals, especially after the World Cup and what you know the short preseason last season. It's just mental. I think you know FA and FIFA and UEFA cheat some of these players like the just crazy at least most of us being having a nice time.

Speaker 2: 58:12

He looks like he's having a good time on all day. He does both both chilling out and keeping fit as well.

Speaker 1: 58:18

So you know he obviously posted fitness videos as well yeah, it'll, I think you know again, with the right additions, and I think we'll see Mo get back to his best. I think, who knows, we'll have a breakout season more less and less running is what I want to see please if we can change that to 90%, 10% the other way.

Speaker 1: 58:40

That's better yeah, well, on that note, we'll leave it there. But yeah, thanks so much. No, worries, because we can tell telling your story and you know it's always great. It doesn't matter, you know who you are. If you have a Liverpool story to tell, you know, it's just fascinating. You know every walk of life as a different story to tell. You know to say we all love the same football club, but it's how you arrive to support in them and you know where you came from and all that.

Speaker 1: 59:14

So it's always great to hear excellent all right nice speaking to you man all right, well, and thank you everyone and for listening and please like and subscribe and, like I said, if you haven't checked out the out and one or young moldy one, please do. Until next time, I'll see you later.